OS 9.x CD not bootable :( - Macintosh Garden

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2014, May 16 - 3:31pm

arti040

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OS 9.x CD not bootable :(

Hi,
i don't know whether it should goes to Support section or here, so if somethnig wrong, mods - i'm sorry and please move the thread to the proper place

Ok, i've just bought few old macs, including PM G4 Digital Audio and iMac G3. They have one big mess on their hardrives so i decided to do fresh installation on each and put there a small collection of my old favorite games. I've downloaded few ISO images of OS9.1 but i'm not able to burn them properly :/ It does not matter which burn software i use (Burn, Apple Disk Utility, Nero, Toast), or if it's ISO, NRG, Apple IMG or even mentioned Toast file. I'm NOT able to boot such CD on real Mac later. Mac does not recognise it at all, but mounting them on OSX shows that all is right - there are system files and all seems to be completely OK. What am i doing wrong?

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2014, May 16 - 3:35pm

Temporary Joe

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Maybe try holding Option when rebooting so the Mac can see all bootable drives?

2014, May 16 - 3:41pm

(Reply to #2) #3

arti040

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It does not work either. Mac starts from HD each time. Strange, because my original Tiger works like a charm - on PM as well as on iMac. I mean, it boots from DVD w/o any problems. Also, any other supported operating systems boots from CD/DVD - MorphOS, Linux etc. Problem occurs only with OS9.x :/

2014, May 16 - 3:43pm

uyjulian

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Most newer macs after G4 do not support booting from Mac OS 9 disks.

2014, May 16 - 3:54pm

(Reply to #4) #5

arti040

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So how to install OS9.x there? PS: does PM from 1998-1999 count as a newer?

2014, May 16 - 9:34pm

sfp1954

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Joined: 2013 Dec 29

Why are you using 9.1?
Once booted from HD does Startup Disk show the CD as having a bootable OS?

Try downloading my 9.2.2 emac disk using OSX.
Unzip.
Open OSX Disk Utility.
Drag .dmg into the lower left corner.
Highlight.
Click the burn button.
http://macintoshgarden.org/apps/macos-install-cd-library

This should work for all G3 and G4 macs that support running 9.2.2 in native mode (not classic emulation).
If you want to run 9.2.2 in Classic mode on a machine that won't boot OS9 (iBook G4, iMac/eMac G4 faster than 1GHz, G5, Powerbook Aluminum G4...) you have to install it on an older machine and then copy/drag the System Folder and Applications (OS9) folder to the newer machine.

Let me know how you make out.

Also when burning images (Toast-OSX) make sure you don't mount them and then drag and drop the contents into Toast in the DATA window. That will not produce a bootable CD. You want to be in COPY window and use the "image file" option.

2014, May 16 - 9:32pm

max1zzz

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Joined: 2010 Oct 3

it might just be the drive, some old drives really struggle to read burned discs (sevrel of my older macs won't read them)

Also, burn the cd at the slowest speed possible, it reduces the risk of getting a bad burn

2014, May 16 - 10:17pm

arti040

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I'm still fighting with it. I burned 10.2, 10.3 (CD) and now i'm bruning 10.4 (DVD).
Nothing from above wants to start from DVD drive :/ In few minuts i'll know, how about Tiger. Also, in few mintues i will have 9.2.2 downloaded and we will see then...

About DVD drive - i bought a new one. It's OK for sure.

EDIT: Tiger does not boot either. It looks like PM doesn't see burned disk at all...
I'm trying now with iMac G3.

2014, May 16 - 11:22pm

(Reply to #8) #9

arti040

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The same with iMac - i got MacOS 9.2.2 from iBook and it's not bootable either

2014, May 17 - 1:49am

(Reply to #9) #10

MikeTomTom

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Joined: 2009 Dec 7

Unless a bootable CD/DVD is universal, then it will need to be Mac model specific.
You should be sure that you're trying a universal bootable install CD

According to everymac.com all Digital Audio's were shipped with 9.1 and the final iMac G3's also shipped with 9.1, so a universal 9.1 CD should be able to boot both of these.

As there doesn't appear to be a universal 9.1 available here, I would be inclined to try the universal 9.2.1 install CD, sfp1954 has kindly archived here (via the link he supplied above). Its the one labeled "Download 9_2_1_U.dmg_.zip (457.34 MB)". That should be able to boot both iMac G3 & DA, without a hitch.

2014, May 17 - 1:54am

(Reply to #8) #11

sfp1954

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Are you using Universal OSX .dmgs for 10.2 (2CDs), 10.3 (3CDs) and 10.4.6 (1DVD)?
If you are using an image of a gray disk that came with a particular machine that won't cut it.

2014, May 17 - 1:42am

#12

uyjulian

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Try USB.

2014, May 17 - 1:50am

(Reply to #10) #13

sfp1954

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Only Intel machines can boot from USB. PPC machines must use Firewire.

2014, May 17 - 1:54am

#14

uyjulian

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Oh, yeah.. forgot about that.

2014, May 17 - 10:19am

#15

max1zzz

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Joined: 2010 Oct 3

Do you have a pressed disk to try?

If the nothing will read i would suspect the drive, even if it is new. Also what did you set the jumpers on the drive to? I seem to recall that my quicksilver wouldn't boot from it's dvd drive when i set the jumper to 'cable select' (although the drive worked fine when in the os)

2014, May 17 - 1:52pm

#16

arti040

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Joined: 2012 Oct 4

@MikeTomTom
Great. There is a little progress I've downloaded 9.1 Universal from location you've sent me.
The CD is recognized as bootable but when i select it, floppy disk with "?" mark is starting to blink - on PM G4 as well as on iMac G3. What's now?

2014, May 18 - 2:09am

(Reply to #16) #17

MikeTomTom

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@arti040: I suggested that you DL ,"9_2_1_U.dmg_.zip (457.34 MB)" which is for a universal 9.2.1 install CD, not 9.1, but I guess thats what you meant to type.

It appears to me that your resulting CD is not bootable, as you're are getting a flashing "?", meaning the Mac cannot locate a bootable System file.

I was however, able to convert this 9.2.1 .dmg image back to a working bootable CD under a classic Mac OS (9.1) on my beige G3.

First, I converted the .dmg to .iso on Windows. - On OS X you can use Disk Utility to convert it to a CD/DVD Master .cdr. Then moved the image over to my G3.

I locked the image file and mounted it locked, using Toast (5.x) to mount the image onto the desktop.

Opposite to advice given above (but on OS9 not OSX), I then dragged the locked mounted image into the "Data" section of Toast with it set to Mac OS CD (I also tried via the "image" setting in Toast, which for me, resulted in a non-bootable CD), I then burned the data to CD.

This resulted in a bootable Mac OS 9.2.1 CD that can boot my beige G3. So if it will boot the beige it must also be able to boot your G4 DA & iMac G3 Macs as they all shipped pre-Mac OS 9.2.

2014, May 17 - 3:29pm

#18

IIGS_User

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@MikeTomTom

Great.

Great also MTT's new avatar symbol.

2014, May 18 - 2:38am

(Reply to #17) #19

MikeTomTom

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@IIGS_User:

Say... Thanks!

2014, May 17 - 4:36pm

#20

max1zzz

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Interesting, if you are getting the floppy disk with a flashing '?' it means the mac os rom has been loaded from the disc, but for whatever reason it doesn't want to load the system

might be intresting to swap it for annother disk after the floppy has come up and see if it boots (i use this to get imac G3's to boot from the secret floppy port, once the mac os rom has been loaded from the hdd it will pass on the bot process to the floppy drive. I also found if you get it into the state you are getting them in to (stalling after loading mac os rom) it will pass the boot process to any bootable drive that is then connected)

2014, May 19 - 8:39pm

(Reply to #18) #21

arti040

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It worked! I mean, almost. First I put 9.1U and when "?" mark appeared i switched it to the 9.0U. System started to boot but after few seconds i got a message: "Unimplemented trap..." with RESTART button. That's all. I'm loosing my hope slowly...

2014, May 19 - 10:20pm

(Reply to #21) #22

sfp1954

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Joined: 2013 Dec 29

Unimplemented trap can mean the software and hardware don't match up.
The other possibilty is corrupt PRAM.
I would try removing the PRAM battery if it is removable.
I would avoid 9.1 in general and either use 9.0.4, 9.2.1 or 9.2.2 (depending on the machine).
The best resource for the correct operating systems is everymac.com.

2014, May 20 - 1:37am

(Reply to #21) #23

MikeTomTom

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I had outlined above the steps I undertook to re-create a bootable 9.2.1 System Install CD from sfp1954's collection. This one would be more than adequate in booting both a G3 iMac & G4 DA.

I've since located a 9.1 and 9.2.2 universal install CD's at WinWorldPC and by using the same steps as outlined in my previous post, have been able to re-create bootable install CD's from each.

These 2 universal install CD's at WinWorldPC are labeled:

Apple Mac OS 9.1.7z ............ 17-Nov-2010 19:24 .... 356M
Apple Mac OS 9.2.2.7z ......... 17-Nov-2010 19:14 .... 434M

All, including the 9.2.2 have been able to boot my old beige G3. As they can do this, a G3 iMac & G4 DA should not present a problem to these boot disks.

[Edit] Attempting to replicate the above on Mac OS X (10.4.11 on G4 iBook), with Toast 5.2.3 and using the same methods as I used on OS 9, results in an unbootable CD

Using the above methods will only work for me under a classic Mac OS, it seems.

2014, May 20 - 6:01am

(Reply to #23) #24

MikeTomTom

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In addition to recreating a successful 9.2.2 install CD obtained from WinWorldPC, linked above. I discovered that this CD will also boot my old 1GHz eMac (FW 400, USB 1.1), one of the final Mac models capable of booting up into classic.

I think this CD will be very useful, as several have asked for a bootable classic CD for late model PPC Macs and its usually the classic image from inside the eMac OS X CD-ROM that gets used. Now you can use a direct 9.2.2 boot CD for those Macs. It boots up a lot of Mac models from a beige G3 through to a 1 GHz eMac.

Anyway, I hope that you get something sorted. I know that I've made a few good discoveries only because you posed the question to begin with.

2014, May 20 - 8:01am

#25

arti040

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Heh, i always forgot - of course, i'm talking about 9.2.1 not 9.1 #facepalm
About converting that DMG to ISO and burning it under Toast later - i have no possibility to do so, because i have no working 9.x system. Or i misunderstood something and i can do this under OSX too?

2014, May 20 - 11:44am

(Reply to #25) #26

MikeTomTom

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@arti040: I have not been able to recreate a bootable Mac OS 9.2.1 from the "9_2_1_U.dmg" file on Mac OS X using Toast under 10.4.11 on a G4 iBook. I've tried burning it under Toast settings; "Other", "Image", & "Mac Volume". All resulting CD's failed to boot on my test Macs.

Only on a classic Mac OS was I able to recreate a bootable disk from this image using the "Other" method outlined in the above posts.

However, once I had a bootable CD made, I have been able to make an .iso image of this copy and from there, successfully burn further bootable CD's from that image, on Mac OS X, using Toast under the "Image" setting.

Go figure.

If you wish I can upload the .iso I've made, for you to try.

2014, May 20 - 7:51pm

(Reply to #26) #27

arti040

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Yay! I've burnt that version from WinWorldPC and it runs! On iMac G3 at least. I'm doing a clean installation now. Later will check my PM G4

Wow, it's kinda wired - all this mess with ISOs, DMGs and many different OS variants... but i'm happy.

EDIT: aAAaand, it worked also for PM G4!

2014, May 20 - 9:27pm

(Reply to #27) #28

MikeTomTom

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That is excellent news. Which one from WinWorldPC? The 9.1 or the 9.2.2? They both are universal but the one that you're using here?

Anyway. Congratulations, you're underway

2014, May 21 - 5:40pm

(Reply to #28) #29

arti040

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I used 9.2.2.

2014, May 21 - 12:58am

(Reply to #25) #30

sfp1954

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In OSX unzip my files and just use the .dmg with Apple Disk Utility (in your Utilities Folder). No need for Toast. I have sold several hundred G3 and G4 Powerbooks on ebay and nobody has ever had any trouble booting from the disks I include.

2014, May 21 - 1:59am

(Reply to #30) #31

MikeTomTom

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I just burned "9_2_1_U.dmg" using Apple Disk Utility (OS X 10.4.11 on iBook G4). Sad to say it resulted in a non-bootable CD for me. Also, the .dmg has been locked at all times before I accessed it with the Utility & previously with Toast.

I haven't DL'd & tested other CD's from your collection, only this one.

The only suitable test Mac I have for booting this CD is a beige G3, my eMac shipped with OS X & 9.2.2 & the iBook G4 USB 2 (is not OS 9 bootable). I was able only to get "9_2_1_U.dmg" bootable by moving it to the G3 after converting the dmg to .iso and then using the "Other" build option in Toast under a classic Mac OS.

Rebuilding this CD and getting it to boot up a Mac was in itself a good thing.

2014, May 20 - 9:47pm

#32

Superguy999

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Joined: 2014 May 20

Are you using a CD?
If your using a DVD, It probably won't work. I used IMGBurn to burn a Mac OS 9.2 disc. Plus if you are burning, Make sure you burn at the correct speed.